Ace of the beast

[Holyblyat]

Hey guys I was just wondering where the ace of the beast was dropping since Blackrock Spire is closed?

[Nodiscord]

I don't think it's dropping anywhere

[Holyblyat]

Maybe but none that I know has ever dropped it, I know it's rare but I would love to get an actual confirmation by who made the server so I know what I need to farm

[wrdlbrmpft]

Ace of Beasts only drops from The Beast in Upper Blackrock Spire, I think the drop chance is around 10%.

More info can be found on wowhead: https://www.wowhead.com/tbc/item=19227/ace-of-beasts

[Cephas]

The general attitude of Felmyst is you don't need 60 items, so they aren't available. They made an exception for Crusader Orbs, and Fiery weapon, but that was a rare exception.

[Holyblyat]

The Beast Deck scales with gear, so it's not just a level 60 item, it stays relevant until the last phase of TBC. Since UBRS is closed on this server, and the admins have said they'll provide other ways to get important drops I just would like to know where they have planned the drop in this case. I'd appreciate any info from the people handling this.

 

[Nodiscord]

7 hours ago, Holyblyat said:

The Beast Deck scales with gear, so it's not just a level 60 item, it stays relevant until the last phase of TBC. Since UBRS is closed on this server, and the admins have said they'll provide other ways to get important drops I just would like to know where they have planned the drop in this case. I'd appreciate any info from the people handling this.

This was already discussed in another thread, but I think that as long as there are reasonable alternatives (like any lvl 70 trinkets), they will not add lvl 60 items back. You would have to make the case that unless you get that specific trinket, you can't even play the class/spec at all. If that's not the case, it is unlikely to happen.

I do think they should make it consistent, though: either disable the drops of all the other cards from the unobtainable decks, or create a chance to get the ace somewhere, to avoid confusion.

[Holyblyat]

2 minutes ago, Nodiscord said:

This was already discussed in another thread, but I think that as long as there are reasonable alternatives (like any lvl 70 trinkets), they will not add lvl 60 items back. You would have to make the case that unless you get that specific trinket, you can't even play the class/spec at all. If that's not the case, it is unlikely to happen.

I do think they should make it consistent, though: either disable the drops of all the other cards from the unobtainable decks, or create a chance to get the ace somewhere, to avoid confusion.

Then why making Righteous Orb drop? Following your logic they shouldn't be in the game either. You can totally do kara without the crusader enchant, everyone can play their class without the crusader enchant and there is a level 70 enchant in there that is better.
Also yes as you just mentioned the other cards drops which make me feel that you can actually make the deck, otherwise why making the rest drop?

[Nodiscord]

9 minutes ago, Holyblyat said:

Then why making Righteous Orb drop? Following your logic they shouldn't be in the game either. You can totally do kara without the crusader enchant, everyone can play their class without the crusader enchant and there is a level 70 enchant in there that is better.
Also yes as you just mentioned the other cards drops which make me feel that you can actually make the deck, otherwise why making the rest drop?

Well, the logic is more complicated than that. Essentially, you need to build a good case. List all the things that are affected by the lack of existence of any particular item, and if it's significant enough, you may have a chance of getting it into the game.

Consider that a specific item, particularly a lvl 60 one is only realistically going to matter on level 70 raids, and even then only for a few characters. An enchant can be used throughout the entire game: leveling items, twinks, etc. Because the scope & effect is broader, it makes more sense to retain those.

Also, the only "upgrade" for something like crusader is a not-guaranteed drop from a raid boss that has a lockout. If mongoose & similar were available as, say, reputation rewards, or for badges, quests, random drops on the outside world, etc., crusader likely also wouldn't have made a return with that as an argument against it.

Let's settle this: why do you want this trinket (as opposed to any other trinket at level 70) & what effect will that have on your & other's gameplay? Please be as elaborate as you can, specifically by mentioning unreasonably hard to acquire alternatives & areas of gameplay where it matters. We can try to build the argument from there, if possible.

P.S. I suspect that the other cards drop because... the GM was too lazy, sorry, too busy fixing other things

 

[Dalzedur]

Crusader orbs are a reagent for other things in addition to Crusader enchant, I think there was two blacksmithing recipes sold by Argent Dawn Quartermaster and such. The other two enchanting recipes one needs them for: enchant gloves - healing power, and enchant weapon - healing power, are not obtainable on Skullcrusher, afaik, but may have been assumed to be available when deciding on adding crusader orbs, possibly.

The main use for crusader enchant is not its endgame relevance, since the str bonus lowers to 60 from 100 when you go from lvl 60 to lvl 70. Rather, it is something of an alt leveling enchant. My hunch is that fiery weapon recipe was added for the sole reason of it being available to help level enchanting to 300 to unlock the TBC enchanting stuff, since it doesn't require difficult materials that you normally would get from the instanced content of late game vanilla (large brilliant shards), but it is also actually a useful enchant, especially for low level alts, so that's nice.

I recall one of the key arguments for not having Vanilla endgame stuff being that there were some items in there that are better than what you get in TBC at level 70, thus with that argument in mind, introducing the issue with "it stays relevant until the last phase of TBC" is not doing your case any favors. Do I personally think DMF decks should be obtainable - absolutely: more to farm, more to do, more stuff to customize your build with. Getting a full deck with this population is already a challenge.

If the code for the items/deck already exists, it should be fairly simple to add that card to the drop table of some rare dragon, or elite world raid enemies, keep it at 10% drop if it is a rare monster or has abnormally long respawn time, or tweak it down accordingly to lower values if it is added to enemies that you can actually farm for it. At best, it might only take a few minutes of work overall, but I'm not sure what other considerations there are to push that change through, possibly would require a server restart at least.